Communal bathing and spas have been around for thousands of years, but the concept of modesty is a relatively recent one for Western culture. Many indigenous people would play sports without any covering, and athletes in ancient Greece also competed naked. In fact, the Greek word gymnasium means “a school for naked exercise.”Taboos against nakedness grew in Europe in the 18th century. Women began to wear more layers of clothing and protected their modesty and avoided the gaze of men at the beach by entering the water through elaborate bathing machines. In the United States, bathing suits were exceedingly modest until the bikini arrived after World War II.But certain aspects of the tradition of naked competition still existed when I was a young man growing up in Chicago in the early 1960’s. One of my worst experiences was being forced to swim in the nude in high school. This was a common practice in Chicago and other large city schools until the 1970’s. You had a choice: either swim in the nude for four years of high school or take ROTC to get a waiver. Envision 30 young boys at various stages of puberty, with a wide variety of body shapes, lining up so the coach, in his well-fitted swimsuit, could take attendance. There was my dramatically overweight friend with his eyes staring straight at the ground and my other friend, a “late bloomer,” just waiting for the inevitable insults about his manhood. There was also the constant anxiety that a pubescent erection could appear at any time. You could only hope that you were already in the pool when it struck. The reasons for this barbaric and hurtful practice were ill-founded—the need for hygiene, the fear of bathing suit threads clogging the pool or the desire to “build cohesion” between young men. Talk to any man raised at that time and you will get similar stories of shame and embarrassment.After physical education we took mandatory showers, our names methodically checked off a list by the now fully-clothed coach. I always looked for a place in the corner of the shower and tried to keep my towel close at hand. Schools and many athletic facilities for men still have communal showers, no stalls.I was already in medical school when I took my military entrance physical for the doctor draft. It was high school all over again. Grown men of different shapes and sizes, lined up to be poked and prodded. No one ever forgets being told to “bend over and grab your ankles.” With the increasing number of women in the military, I decided to research the current military physical exam. The article contains a section, “For Women Only,” where it proudly states that, “your visit with the physician will be in a private room.” Not so for the men, apparently. Six paragraphs down under a section titled “Do”, it says “Wear normal underwear. You will be sorry if you don’t!” Once again, a man’s modesty is a joke.Many men don’t speak up about their desire for privacy in fear that they will be mocked for not being “man enough.” In Texas we ask young men to “cowboy up.” There is the assumption that men bond by swimming or showering together in the nude, but I can assure you that, given a choice, we would have rather worn a bathing suit and showered in a stall. Locker rooms and the military are obvious examples, but let’s not forget the doctor’s office. In medical school men are instructed on how to examine female patients and respect their modesty. I must admit that for many years I never instructed a medical student on the need have a similar concern for men.
Over the years I’ve practiced medicine, I learned several things about male modesty that I don’t ever remember being told during my training. Many men don’t like being watched while they undress. I leave the room while they change, and offer them the same gowns I would a female patient, rather than assuming they are comfortable sitting around in their underwear. Gynecomastia (growth of male breast tissue) is common in all men. We generally think of it as a phenomenon of aging, but a surprising 65 percent of adolescents have it to some degree. Many men do not feel comfortable taking off their shirt to get into a hot tub or swimming pool, and, just like women, they may also feel uncomfortable sitting on the examination table without a shirt or gown. What’s more, a digital rectal exam can be just as unnerving to a man as a pelvic examination can be for a woman.
I like to talk with my doctor with my clothes on but, in the name of efficiency, I am often asked to undress and wait. We talk, he in his white coat and me in my Jockeys. The playing field is not level. Our culture tells men to “man up”, but the doctor’s office is one place you shouldn’t have to.
You’re making a big deal out of nothing.
Men and boys may be of different shapes and sizes, but are more similar than different.
It’s hard to understand why our society has such a hangup about nudity? Society expects all men and women to grow up, get married, and have children, which of course means having sex, which is usually done in the nude. On top of that, we even ostracize people who are virgins, which seems to be pure hypocrisy.
Sex is all over the place and expected of all of us as adults, but shame shame if we let anyone see us naked.
Human beings are all the same, except for maybe the color of their skin or some slight differences in shape.
The hangup you have with communal showers is pathetic, but of course you privileged people think you should be treated special on account of you being embarrassed about your own body. And you being a medical practitioner makes hangups over nudity even more pathetic.
Can you imagine the costs involved with schools having to build individual shower stalls of all the students who need to shower before their next class?
One thing that makes sense having communal showers in schools is the money it saves tax payers.
Our society is becoming so narcissistic and individualistic that its hard to believe we even dare talk to each other.
God forbid anyone seeing them naked these days.
Maybe God should have created humans fully clothed?
As(s) I wrote in a previous comment, I took swim lessons in at our City pool – in the early “60s. Though lessons were co-ed, the Municipal bathhouse wasn’t – of course. The boys section had an open changing area/group shower, ya’ were expected to use before donning trunks. I was 9 years old in “61 & undersized compared to most boys in that bathhouse. But(t), to use that pun, I eventually got over stripping to my “birthday suit” in front the others. It accustomed me for open group showers in Junior/Senior high school & Uncle Sam’s Selective Service physical! The latter required every orifice of our bodies be examined – including our anus/rectums! As(s) we went onto a curtained platform, Uncle Sam’s proctologist told us to drop our undershorts & bend at the waist. he went from butt to butt spr-e-e-a-a-ding our cheeks, looking for tumors, lesions, hidden drugs? or maybe to see if we wiped enough. While I’m on the subject of dariers (maybe I’ve mentioned it before or not) but(t) not every BODY in my Sophomore gym class worried about butt hygiene. After gym the guys had to shower; it was & still is an open-group shower. Most gym classes had one or more guys who’d not bother with butt hygiene. My gym class was no exception, the guy was Nelson, a “happy-go-lucky” type 🤣, from “the wrong side of the tracks.” While sittin’ on one of those narrow benches, puttin’ my street duds on, out from the group 🚿🚿🚿 came Nelson, laughing. As(s) he walked past me, odor from his butt hit me like a BRICK WALL – PEEEUUU! 💩🙊
His butt didn’t just stink, it gave off a STENCH, from even a few steps away!
Not only could smell it, I saw why it stunk! His butt-crack was black with feces, dry & not so dry, up & down his crack! He must’ve gotten used to it, as(s) guys from the wrong side of the tracks do; he wasn’t a shit-ass above his waist, but(t) sure was below it! Even if he did wipe, ASSuming he wore underwear, ‘must’ve
left a bold racin’ stripe!! HO😮HO😮HO😮! Some guys, as an expression I’d hear in gym'(didn’t)”shake it all off” before wiping. For the life of me, I don’t how else his butt could’ve gotten as(s) strong an odor! Maybe I’m going too far on this, but(t) knowing his cavalier attitude, he might as(s) well used toilet paper ass backwards, fold some sheets of it before poopin’, then use it catch his 💩 as(s) it’s comin’ out smearing 💩 up & down his butt?
Back again, with another excerpt from My(& Others’) Rite(s)-of-Passage”.
A favorite story, “War of the Buttons” was filmed in France (1962); but(t), to use a pun, British versions came out in 1994* and 2011, about a “war” between two “gangs” of boys from different social classes. The 1994
version probably has the best remake of the following scene but(t) all of ’em are on YouTube.
Their’s an ongoing mini-version of class warfare where each side keeps score by removing buttons from their adversary’s clothes. Apparently, the boys from the working-class side of town were running low on buttons, they decided to change the paradigm. Their next battle would deprive the “preppie” snobs of anymore buttons, they’d not only not wear buttons, they’d not wear anything!
*A final climatic battle occurs on a mountain slope with the preppie gang, wearing their usual black school suits, white shirts & ties. The preppies know the lower-class boys are hidden behind some boulders & challenge them to come out to fight. One of the latter, still fully clothed, sitting on a boulder puts a bugle to his mouth & blows the note for his comrades to rise out of the rocks & charge buck-naked down the slope. They put out a tribal war cry spooking the fully clothed preppies who skidadle despite their leader telling ’em to stand their ground. One pugnacious chubby preppie lands facedown in a fresh cowpie! 💩 The director should have “milked” this scene – have one of the boys “from the wrong side of the tracks” sit on this Trump – like bully, shoving his face back into it giving ’em a shampoop!💩😆 That’s the spirit of barnyard humor! As if their retreat wasn’t humiliating, a group of girls from their school rigged a small bridge over a stream. As the preppies fled over it, they pulled a support causing it & the preppies to land in the drink. Again, it’d been better if it been over a mud bog. The working-class boys had pursued the preppies all the way to where
the girls had pulled the small bridge. Most of the buck-naked boys, embarrassed to be seen by the girls – fled, excerpt for the leader who stood
with a satisfied expression of “victory” in front of of ’em that one of the girls admired. Who says females want males to be “cute”?
After reading Mr. Selenick’s long post on mandatory group male nudity, I have to agree with the reply from “GH”. I’m old enough to remember the phrase: grow a thick skin! Though I wasn’t in the Boy Scouts, my Brother was in the early “60s. In the Summer of “61 his Scout chapter hosted Parents day. My folks let me come with ’em to tour Camp Decorah, WI. I was taken aback when I saw their indoor latrine. It was undivided holes over a pit or maybe buckets?! I assume the camp had an open group shower.
In my essay “A History of Latrines” I’ve included photos of
outdoor latrines with no privacy. Ya’ couldn’t call ’em privies ’cause they’re not private. One of ’em is 2 commodes facing away from each other divided by a wood board but no enclosure, one of ’em is occupied by 2 adolescents who must not’ve minded havin’ their picture taken! Another is even more open, it was just some cut branches arranged like “A” frames similar to those supporting a swing set, but(t) 2 horizontal branches straddled those end frames, one for Scouts to lean back on
& the other to put their upper legs on while dumpin’ their 💩 into a pit! The message must’ve been: shed your namely-pamby middle-class upbringing! But(t) Boy Scouts of America have or had more than one merit badge for butt hygiene! I’d say they’d better have a good sense of balance using the latter latrine if they wanted to merit one of those badges! Unfortunately, Boy Scouts of America has gone co-gender. Would the girls be willing to use the latrines I’ve described?